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Subject: hydraulic fluid or Gear oil

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Gayla Stahl    Posted 05-08-2017 at 18:18:38 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • hydraulic fluid or Gear oil
  • (1)I am confused on what to use for the hydraulics and transmission on an 8n Ford, do I use hydraulic oil or gear oil, and if gear oil what weight?

    (2) The hydraulic were working good when the tractor was cold, but when it heated up, they would either go all the
    way up or all the way down, no middle.

    Tim Daley(MI)    Posted 05-09-2017 at 13:28:14 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: hydraulic fluid or Gear oil
  • When the lift system acts squirrely like that, you have issues internally, not necessarily the wrong oil. I suggest you R&R the hydraulic system thoroughly, starting with condition of oil -is it diluted with water? If it is a murky brown color then yes it is contaminated and I further suggest you don't use the lift at all until you fix it. You can go the archives here and plug in any keyword(s) to get multiple old replies/posts to your questions. We also have a ton of DIY PM projects to do as well in our HOW-TO's forum. Meantime, here is a LINK to some info on HISTORY forum about the Ford Hydraulic oil. Also, here are some words from a member here, TOH (The Old Hokie) on hydraulic oil...

    "...The Ford tractor oil sold at TSC is nothing more than SAE 90 GL-1 gear oil. That is as generic as it gets and about the lowest performing gear oil you can buy today. The N-series owner's manual specifies M4864A/B tractor oil. That was the 1940 Ford specification for industry standard SAE 80 a 90 mild EP gear oil. In the current world that would be most nearly approximated by a GL4 gear oil. Putting "specially formulated for old Ford tractors" on the label of the generic GL-1 gear oil is nothing more than marketing hype aimed at people who will believe anything they see on a label. It is the lowest performing gear oil you could possibly choose for your tractor and not what Ford recommended during N-series production.
    As I said before - in today's world there is nothing special about the 50+ year old M2C-134D specification or the Ambra Multi-G 134 oil that CNH was selling. That specification is just an old OEM specification for what is now industry standard and inexpensive Universal Tractor Transmission Fluid (UTTF). Kubota has one they call UDT, JD has HyGard, and CNH now has HyTran which is their newest formulation that replaces MasterTran and Multi-G 134 in most of their applications. They are all virtually identical UTTF products. Fundamentally UTTF is nothing more than a high viscosity index, mild EP, SAE 80 grade gear oil with GL-4 level performance.
    In some specific "state of the art" type applications the OEM formulations are very carefully tailored to the peculiar friction requirements of the OEM design and generic formulations may not provide the same level of performance. Limited slip differentials, viscous drives, and hydrostatic and synchromesh manual transmissions are some examples of where the OEM oils MAY be a better choice. A 60+ year old N-series tractor is not one of those applications.
    In a nutshell my recommendation is use any good quality UTTF, avoid low end UTTF's (the "303" branded stuff in particular), and if you want to use a gear oil avoid mono-grade GL-1 oil and use a mild EP multi-grade formulation with GL4/GL5 level performance.

    TOH..."

    Gaspump    Posted 05-09-2017 at 21:07:32 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: hydraulic fluid or Gear oil
  • Nice dissertation on gear oil as specified for the N tractors. Gl-1 was not the original gear oil for Ford N's. However starting in about 1941 until about 1947 SMO 90w was a specified gear oil and for a time 50w motor oil was also a specified for gear lube. The only reason for the temporary straying from the original spec was severe shortages to downright unavailability of mild EP 90w due WWII. Most everything was rationed including the food on our tables. Farming was tough, blow a tire and you need to scratch for a usable Junker, planting corn, what no fertilizer, need tractor gas OK you can order some, up to 50 gallons if they had any, not any more and don't get caught hoarding gas if you want to be able to buy more. I feel that when people read the old manuals they do not have a clue as to what life during WWII was like. Also if they are reading a war time manual they don't know that the specs in that particular manual were temporary. Right on the marketing hype perpetuates the GL-1 myth and folks do tend to believe anything they see on the net or read on labels.

    Bruce (VA)    Posted 05-08-2017 at 21:31:03 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: hydraulic fluid or Gear oil
  • See tips 3 & 4 at the link.

    Ncorrigible    Posted 05-10-2017 at 14:11:14 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: hydraulic fluid or Gear oil
  • Oh - pmhaas49 @ gmail.com

    To Bruce    Posted 05-10-2017 at 14:03:44 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: hydraulic fluid or Gear oil
  • I am seeing if this works. I go by Ncorrigible on the tractor site. If you get this and reply, I would like to set up a connection. If you do not - just do not answer and I will not bother you again.

    Larry Holbrook    Posted 05-08-2017 at 19:22:27 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: hydraulic fluid or Gear oil
  • This is from John Smith Old Ford Tractors.

    A: Originally, the 8N used 90w (GL-1) gear oil for the transmission, rear gears and hydraulics common sump. Capacity is 5 gallons. Many people today recommend using Ford 134 oil. This usually works fine in the 8N and is not so stiff in cold weather. However, if your system tends to leak, or you have a lot of wear in the hydraulic system, you probably need the heavier oil to keep things working and slow the leakdown rate. I use 80w90 gear oil (GL-5) or 90w (GL-1) in mine, just because it always works fine for me. When draining the gear oil, be sure to remove all 3 drain plugs (one under the transmission, one under the hydraulic pump, and a 3/4" pipe plug under the rear differential).

    BlasterStumps    Posted 05-08-2017 at 18:33:36 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: hydraulic fluid or Gear oil
  • Have you looked to see what the condition of the cam follower pin is? If it is badly worn, you may need to either rotate it or replace it. It's also good to check for leaks at the pump. You should be able to see both by taking the right side cover off and looking in. I believe 90 weight has been used by some folks in lieu of the Hydraulic fluid. Not sure though.

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