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Subject: Distributors are happy now

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Farmer Dan    Posted 09-09-2017 at 16:54:12 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Distributors are happy now
  • Got some more parts in today so I was able to finish two of the distributors I have to rebuild. Most parts are available through Ace Hardware or McMaster Carr. Napa is no longer on my list of suppliers, they don't stock anything anymore and their prices are too high. Still have not found a source for the 91A-12159 primary contact screw but I can make an accurate replacement, just takes a little time.

    Jock(OR)    Posted 09-16-2017 at 01:01:06 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • I just checked the CS35 Echlin points on my NAPA Prolink search, and my store has two sets in stock and there are four more at the nearest distribution center 70 mile away with free overnight delivery to the store. The Seattle DC has four sets and the Sacramento DC has six.

    It looks like NAPA still has them in the system.

    Tim Daley(MI)    Posted 09-10-2017 at 07:33:53 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • Cool beans. FYI: I haven't tried my local NAPA lately but the last time I was there they said their front mount rotor and condenser part numbers weren't coming up. It may be time to add them to my NO-FLY ZONE LIST of suppliers not to support. The list so far has TSC, CNH (most of the time), and I just added Fastenal. I can get most basic hardware at CNH for $2 per pound but everything else is way overpriced and they do not make the MC-134D hydraulic oil any longer. The other places want $2 just for one nut and that's only if stocked! Fastenal moved in a few years ago, forced a place called Mid-States Nut & Bolt out town, and never have what I need, just like TSC, and the only place open on Sundays is TSC. Mid-States is around everywhere but here, the closest being 25 miles away but they always had what I needed and if not it was there the next day with no added shipping charges.

    If you need any 3/64" Cotter Pins for the points, just holler. For a close substitute for the 91A-12159 Distributor Coil Contact Screw, look at this from McM-Carr. It is a brass 8-32 x .31" socket head cap screw. The original screw has a radius dish on the head for the coil contact spring pocket. The head diameter on the original is .344", this one is only .27" but the 9/32" hex pocket may be sufficient to act as the coil spring pocket. The length on their sizes offers a 5/16" screw but I'd opt for the longer 3/8" one as shown in the LINK in case you need to raise the height up with a washer in order to make sufficient spring contact, but the head width on both are the same at .165" so either the 5/16" or the 3/8" length size will work. I'm just suggesting this until we find an OEM source or someone to make some.

    Tim Daley(MI)

    Tim Daley(MI)    Posted 09-11-2017 at 07:44:51 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • The HEX size on the SHCS is 9/64, not 9/32 as first stated, my bad. If head diameter is .27" the HEX can't be 9/32 ---DOH! I've been looking for something relatively close, even would accept a brass 8-32 HEX HEAD but no such luck, at least not at McM-Carr, and if they don't stock it, it ain't made. The 91A12159 screw was used across many Ford distributor modules, but, like many old Ford parts, is no longer serviced. I have a call out to my Early V8 buddies, specifically 1939 as that is what the 91A Ford Prefix designates when first used, for more info on the part. A true screw machine would be ideal. Here's how I would make them on an engine lathe: Chuck a length of 3/8" diameter brass rod; face & turn major OD at .344" and to a length of 17/32 (.531"); then part off. I calculated a 1/32" wide cutoff insert and leaving a half a millimeter for a finish face cut on the secondary operation to turn and thread the stem. Here's where I'd prefer a CNC Lathe with Live Tooling. After facing and turning, I'd use a 5/16" Ball Nose Endmill and Machine the coil spring well pocket to depth. Next, use a 1/16" endmill to cut the screw slot to size and depth. 2nd Turn Operation: Flip part around, collet chuck the turned end with positive stop on back face. Finish face to overall length of .475" and turn the 8-32 UNC major diameter at .163" for .31" length with a slight undercut at shoulder face. Single point 8-32 UNC thread full length. Without the actual drawing, here are the 91A12159 screw specs as best as I can determine: Head - .344" diameter at .165" width. Coil Spring Well Socket at 5/16" diameter to 1/32" depth. Screw slot - 1/16" width to 1/16" depth from face. 8-32 UNC 2A to .31" full length. A CNC Lathe/Screw Machine could to produce the entire part in one operation. Perhaps Kevin Norman at Carpenter will read this and start repopping them. Unless someone already makes these, I'm kind of surprised DC hasn't already made them.

    ORIGINAL FORD 91A12159 DISTIBUTORT COIL SPRING CONTACT SCREW:

    Tim Daley(MI)

    Farmer Dan    Posted 09-11-2017 at 10:55:38 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • I have asked DC to repop these and never got an answer. Knock on wood I will be able to get in my shop this friday and make a few with my fabulous Atlas 618 lath LOL.

    Tim Daley(MI)    Posted 09-11-2017 at 12:14:57 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • Dennis is pretty much retired, his son runs the place/business and Kevin Norman is the QC Manager and go-to guy anyway. We might get better success asking Derek Barkley. As is with any part, the demand must be there in order to produce it.

    Tim Daley(MI)

    TheOldHokie    Posted 09-11-2017 at 10:16:53 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • A little simpler - buy the filister head screw and dot the head with a #5 countersink. Then use a #8 brass washer under the head. Here is my setup and the first screw. I'm still setup and have the remaining 99 screws left in the box. A buck-fifty and the cost of a stamp will get anybody that wants them a bag of 3 screws with washers.

    TOH

    TheOldHokie    Posted 09-11-2017 at 10:39:57 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • I just discovered that a binding head screw has the larger head diameter so no washer needed. I have several hundred of them in steel but I'll get a couple boxes of brass ones on my next order. After dimpling you will never know they aren't OEM.

    TOH

    Tim Daley(MI)    Posted 09-11-2017 at 12:33:13 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • Dan-
    I'll take a half dozen. My check will be in the mail. Send to Windy Ridge? My email is open...

    Tim Daley(MI)

    TheOldHokie    Posted 09-11-2017 at 18:17:55 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • Give me a chance to catch my breath - been on the golf course all day ;-)

    Once I have time to get a batch made I'll get back to you. It will be a few days - more golf tomorrow....

    TOH

    Tim Daley(MI)    Posted 09-12-2017 at 05:39:11 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • What'd you shoot?

    No hurry on the screw; I don't need any, just want to stock up so I have them handy when I do need one. As many of us who have worked on these old distributors have discovered, a lot of times original parts are so hacked up from 60-70 years of abuse it would be best to replace with new.

    Tim Daley(MI)

    TheOldHokie    Posted 09-12-2017 at 07:31:29 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • Yesterday was a 74 - low man shot 69 and I lost my $20. The setup is still in place and undisturbed so I should be able to knock a batch of them out Wednesday.

    Farmer Dan    Posted 09-11-2017 at 11:00:26 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • Will the side walls of the head be tall enough to capture and hold the spring?

    Tim Daley(MI)    Posted 09-11-2017 at 12:30:28 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • The 'side walls' aren't really much nor needed. Once the radius is machined, the 'wall' is only about .015" on each side, really not much there anyway. On the original, and in my post earlier, I dimensioned the coil spring well pocket incorrectly. It should have been stated as a .1563" Radius and an "Over-The-Roll" dimension from top of the screw head to the top of the 5/16" diameter. That equals .2813, or 9/32". A moot point as TOH seems to have found a better screw to alter and would be faster to make. I'm going get my screw, and a coil to see just how much area is really needed. The pigtail point is what makes the contact/electrical connection. The spring action just ensures pressure keeps it applied.

    Tim Daley(MI)

    TheOldHokie    Posted 09-11-2017 at 11:12:45 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • Well spamk my pants. It turns out the binding head screws I have are actually some sort of white brass. Because of the color I had assumed they were steel but the boxes all say brass and they machined like brass. Yes - the cavity will easily capture the spring. Here is the one I just did - no washer needed. I can probably make the concavity a little larger diameter with some experimentation.

    TOH

    Farmer Dan    Posted 09-11-2017 at 15:43:16 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • Well I'm out of work for another week :-( so time to pull a chair out and take a break. After seeing TOH use a counter sink I thought I would give it a try. Anybody know where my countersinks went? I used a coupler nut to hold a 8-32x3/8 brass screw in the lathe and touched it with a #6 drill bit sharpened at a 118° and it worked almost perfect. I think we are over thinking this. Like Tim says it shouldn't take much to catch that spring and hold it in place.


    Got my worst distributor done now and Tim yours is in the ultra sonic cleaner with some spicNspan. I'll do it next.

    TheOldHokie    Posted 09-11-2017 at 18:27:45 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • A drill bit was my first try - it wandered a bit once it hit the slots. It's all angle anyway so probably a bigger twist drill with less flex will get the job done just as well. I just drilled and tapped an 8-32 hole in a piece of scrap with a little mill/drill for the work holding fixture. I don't think this is rocket science.

    I have a boat load of the 8-32 binding head screws - back in the day my old boss was building a gadzillion RS232 wall mount boxes and was using/buying them by the thousands. I took the leftovers when industry caught up ;-)

    TOH

    TheOldHokie    Posted 09-10-2017 at 12:44:14 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • I have box (100) of brass fillister head screws I purchased a couple months ago with the intention of making a batch of those dished screws. Just got to get around tuit.

    TOH

    Farmer Dan    Posted 09-10-2017 at 10:10:50 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • Next time at Napa tell them you are working on a 1946 Ford Super Deluxe, it will bring up the FD-6769X points.

    That being said "Standard Brand" the guys that make Echlin and Blue Streak no longer list Napa as a distributor.

    Tim Daley(MI)    Posted 09-10-2017 at 19:49:37 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Distributors are happy now
  • NAPA Front Mount Points CS-35, the ECHLIN brand anyway...I bought a set back in May but haven't had to since...I'd stock up if they plan on dumping those too.

    Tim Daley(MI)

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