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Subject: Gasoline suggestions?

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Gary in GA    Posted 04-27-2020 at 10:15:37 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Gasoline suggestions?
  • Over winter my 8N developed some problems resulting in my rebuilding my carburetor. Had some sort of buildup on the steel parts, and sediment in the bottom of the bowl. Drained the gas tank and no evidence I can see of debris or water in the tank. R& R the sediment bowl and cleaned. Normally I run ethanol free gas in the tractor, but was wondering if I should run a load of high test with some SeaFoam to clean the system out since high test is ďsupposedĒ to have all of these additives to clean the system. Either way, Iíll run som Sea Foam with the first tank to burn off any moisture I the system. Or does it matter either way with the gasoline?

    K.LaRue-VA    Posted 04-29-2020 at 20:01:43 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • I've never used anything but regular pump gas in my tractors, side-by-side, chainsaw or lawnmower. I used to put Stabil in the generator since that one can get ignored easier than anything else. I lost that habit several years ago, so by now the generator just has pump gas in it. It has been many years since anything has had any type of fuel problem. I think early problems I had when pump gas first changed to "contains 10% ethanol" were caused by all the deposits the ethanol cleaned out of my tanks. I did have to replace the fuel lines on my chainsaw. The original plastic fuel system parts were not ethanol resistant. The replacement stuff apparently was. Any of my equipment might sit as much as 3 months between uses, certainly the generator does. The lawnmower fired the first time this season almost before I got the key turned. If I did have a problem with fuel quality, I'd be more likely to suspect the place I last bought fuel from. A supplier nearby had a problem with his tanks a few years ago. They found out mixing regular gas with diesel doesn't work well in any engine. Their insurance company wasn't happy.

    Dave H    Posted 04-28-2020 at 08:24:39 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • I PUT A petcock in the drain plug hole in the bottom of the carb.

    Jock(OR)    Posted 04-28-2020 at 14:37:01 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • So did I, back in the early 1970's, when my father had problems with water in the gas of our 2N. We later determined that condensation in the farm tank was causing the problem. It was a 600 gallon tank, and my father was only filling it to 200 gallons to save money. That left a large volume of air in the tank, which greatly increased the condensation. Going to a smaller farm tank solved the problem.

    If you use ethanol gas and let the tractor sit for a long period of time, it might be useful to turn off the gas at the tank and drain the carburetor bowl with the petcock. You might have to loosen the fuel filter bowl to let the air in to drain the bowl and line.

    Tim Daley(MI)    Posted 04-28-2020 at 07:25:27 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?

  • In 1978 the EPA banned lead in all US products. Lead is still present in older homes, toys, plumbing (does the Flint water fiasco ring a bell?) and other products so those items would still be present with lead. The crud they try to pass off as a 'lead additive' isn't, they canít legally sell it, and contains no lead whatsoever. Just another snake oil product, AND you don't need to use a regular gas. Search for the MSDS sheets when researching a product so you can see what is in it. If they won't list ingredients, claim it is "Proprietary" they are hiding something so run away. Statements like ďÖthe proprietary additive mixture includes anti-oxidant, detergent, and anti-corrosion additives.Ē Huh? Why donít they list exactly what that stuff is. Mumbo-jumbo mostly. MMO??? Thereís no mystery about it. ALL the snake-oil products sold today contain 75%-98% PETROLOEUM DITSILLATES, plain mineral oil/spirits. It is an excellent cleaner and will not affect internal engines and systems. It is the same stuff as your charcoal lighter fluid and paint thinner. I use it for cleaning parts, hydraulic systems, and paint cleaner, and buy it in 5 gal pails. Adding all that commercial stuff to an engine will thin the fuel and help clean the system because of the main ingredient Ėmineral spirits. Iíve used gas that is over a year old, in my 8N, and it started and ran fine. Iíd add fresh gas after it ran and cooled down but if your tractor wonít start after setting for a spell, chances are it isnít the gas and something else like a dead battery (a float charger will fix that) or oxidized breaker point contacts. The fuel additive issue has been discussed over and over, and the TOH has posted thorough data on ethanol which has been blamed for boiling gas in the tank and destroying nylon and plastic fuel lines especially on 2-stroke engines. The Ford Tractors do not use any plastic or nylon in the fuel system. There is a oil and gas resistant rubber seal in the sediment bulb valve stem but thatís it. Some cheaper aftermarket systems have used vinyl seals which get chewed up and ruined in short order. Iíve found the best carb cleaner is plain Lacquer Thinner. It is composed of Methyl, Ethanol, Acetone, and Mineral Spirits along with a few other ingredients, and works best to un-gum old internal carbs. When not in use, I fill my gas tank with diesel fuel to help prevent internal corrosion. My early 9N has been soaking in it, yes Madge, for years and works very well. Now, itís your tractor and machines, and you can spend your $$$ on and do whatever you want, I am simply stating the facts so you can make your own decisions. Whatever you use, be aware that all of those products are highly flammable and not for consumption use common sense and read labels. See the LINK from our SAFETY forum.

    Tim Daley(MI)

    Ultradog MN    Posted 04-28-2020 at 11:21:44 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • Tim,
    I've never had any issues Running ethanol gas in an engine.
    I have had problems with ethanol gas that was left in the carb for too long. Big difference.

    .

    Brad    Posted 04-28-2020 at 08:54:03 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • "In the world of marketing. there's no such thing as a lie, merely convenient exaggerations."

    A typical example: Original formulation of Slick 50 is not what's being sold today as Slick 50. Interesting story here: A Marketing Group owns trademark/product called Slick 50, but never owned original formulation they marketed as Slick 50.

    This from video interview of originator and inventor of product promoted/labeled and first product sold as Slick 50. https://youtu.be/CAt-tJa9P_s?t=16

    It is what it is and what it is, is "caveat emptor"! :-) That's why I enjoy YouTube channel Project Farm's trials of commercial products to find the "real deal".

    Bruce (VA)    Posted 04-27-2020 at 10:37:22 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • I've been using regular ethanol in everything around here for years. That's 5 old Ford tractors, a golf cart and push mower.

    Everything gets MMO ( Marvel Mystery Oil) in the gas.

    Everything gets Star-Tron fuel stabilizer in the gas as well.

    I never had a fuel system problem as you describe.

    " was wondering if I should run a load of high test " No, that's wasting your time and money. Those additives work well on injectors and sensors.

    Gary in GA    Posted 04-28-2020 at 17:43:23 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • Well here is the next update in my situation: After I thoroughly cleaned and rebuilt my carburetor, I drained the remaining gas from the gas tank and cleaned out my sediment bowl. Gas ran freely through the line from the tank to the carb. I opened the main to 2 turns, the idle to 1 1/2 turns and tried to start. It finally caught and will run only if I hold the choke full open until it warms up, and even then I runs really rough. If I release the choke, it stalls and dies until it warms up. This is completely out of ordinary for this tractor. Always, the first start after winter nap I open the petcock 2 turns, hold the choke open the width of my index finger and I cranks and runs fine on the first revolution.
    The tractor was beset by gremlins over the winter as it cost me a new battery,coil, plugs, rebuild carburetor and half tank of gas.
    Suggestions gentlemen?

    Ultradog MN    Posted 04-28-2020 at 03:45:05 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • I think for a tractor that gets run a lot regular ethanol gas is fine.
    The trouble is when they sit.
    The 3 cyl gasser I had got a new $400 Zenith carb shortly after I bought it.
    It ran fine on ethanol gas.
    When I broke my leg, the tractor sat for nearly 18 months with no additives in the fuel. It ran like crap and I had to open the carb and clean it thouroughly. Had a lot of weird, light green crystals in it. I've messed with a lot of old and new engines and had never seen that green stuff in a carb.
    I think if an engine sits for any length of time, like more than a month or two, a guy should put an additive in the gas. For summer time when it's getting 10 tanks of fuel run through it the additive is not so important - or such is my theory.

    Brad    Posted 04-27-2020 at 17:44:19 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • Good to hear what works out well for you Bruce.

    Last year all my small engine carburetors were wrecked by ethanol in the regular gasoline that I used.

    Mostly I was able to repair (had to replace one carburetor, couldn't clear crud from passageways) and remove corrosion caused by ethanol attacking the metal inside carburetors, and get my older equipment running properly.

    Afterwards, in my small engines, I ran strictly ethanol free gasoline to avoid this headache, and followed proper Winter storage procedures.

    I'm quite pleased to learn your method using Marvel Mystery Oil in the gasoline, and brand of fuel stabilizer which you've had good luck with.

    There was a cost in time and expense dealing with carburetors, which I am not eager to repeat lol :-)

    Bruce(VA)    Posted 04-27-2020 at 18:31:42 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • Big difference between pot metal or aluminum carbs and plastic fuel lines on 2 cycle stuff and a oem carb/fuel lines on an N tractor.

    Those things are a PITA no matter what fuel you run in them.

    All my 2 cycle stuff gets run every 3 months.

    Gary in GA    Posted 04-27-2020 at 19:09:02 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • The main needle and the piece which secured the float in the carb (both steel) were both corroded and cleaning didn't remove it. My sediment bowl had a 1/8" sediment buildup in the cup and rust in the carb bowl. Think I will stay with ethanol free for now as this is what it ran on originally. I remember in the 60s American was the first to offer nonleaded fuel. All others offered leaded fuel. Would a lead additive have any merit?

    Bruce (VA)    Posted 04-27-2020 at 20:06:18 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • " Would a lead additive have any merit?"

    Not a bit.

    See tip # 5

    Jock(OR)    Posted 04-28-2020 at 00:05:51 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: Gasoline suggestions?
  • I suspect that the buildup you had was the result of prior exposure to ethanol gas. I had to scrap a gas tank from a CJ2A Jeep because the buildup was so bad.

    I also run non-ethanol gas in my small engines. I run the N's on it too, because that is what I have the farm tank filled with. It costs more, but it is worth it in time and money saved.

    Most needles I have seen are stainless steel (some with rubber tips), and the seats were brass. I have a 2N that is still using a needle & seat from the 1960's. It doesn't leak, and never has.

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