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Subject: unknown gear cluster in very front of center section

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Jack Bud    Posted 06-16-2020 at 16:39:08 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • unknown gear cluster in very front of center section
  • I pulled center section found a 3 gear cluster sandwiched between 2 thick trapazoidal plates. My number is 8N347216[star]. The star is stamped next to last serial number. I can't find anything in the books or parts websites that refer to this component. It has to do with 1951 experimental draft controls ford was testing and an additional control lever. There is a brass patent pend. plate riveted to the plate that's bolted to back of tranny housing. Another N mystery.

    Bruce Dorsi    Posted 06-17-2020 at 07:32:50 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: unknown gear cluster in very front of center section
  • .

    Tim Daley(MI)    Posted 06-17-2020 at 05:42:11 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [Email]  
  • Re: unknown gear cluster in very front of center section
  • No, no such thing as an 'experimental draft control' in 1951. DRAFT CONTROL was used on the 9N beginning in 1939. Any and all 'experimenting' was done by Ford engineers at the Rouge in 1938/1939. ALL FORD vehicle serial numbers used the STAR (*) symbol for the prefix and the suffix. It was to denote steel cylinder sleeves were used and used up until early 1950 then changed to a DIAMOND SYMBOL (<>) and cast iron liners were now used. Serial numbers were hand stamped one digit and character at a time and thus a lot ended up being weak and unaligned. You can look closer at yours and probably find the leading star on yours, but, a moot point now since steel liners are no longer serviced. Makes one wonder why FORD had to define steel in the first place. We'll get back to that. To answer previous question, NO, Ford didn't have any 'experimental' draft control systems or special markings. The first working DRAFT CONTROL was designed by the Ferguson team on the 1936 Ferguson-Brown Type A Tractor and it was the Ford engineering team who improved and revised it beginning in November, 1938, when Harry Ferguson and Henry Ford shook hands and the 9N was born. ALL 9N and 2N models had DRAFT CONTROL only. It was the FORD team who designed and built the POSITION CONTROL system and first released in conjunction with DRAFT CONTROL (see RH lever under seat?) with the new 8N Model in July, 1947. Any brass plate was most likely added by a dealer -NOT a factory item. JMOR and Bruce(OR) answered the initial question about the Howard Transmission. We have some info on it in our HOW-TO’s forum. What parts books and what web site are you referencing? We have it all on this web site –the NTC. If you want me to post your pictures, email them in jpg and I can put them in your post here.

    FORD ENGINE BLOCK SERIAL NUMBER IDENTIFICATION:

    FORD N-SERIES TRACTOR SERIAL NUMBER LOCATION:


    FORD 8N TRACTOR ESSNETIAL OWNER/OPERATOR/PARTS/SERVICE MANUALS:

    Tim Daley(MI)

    Tim Daley(MI)    Posted 06-17-2020 at 08:23:57 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Clarification
  • FORD engineers were working on a different hydraulic system practically from the 8N start-up the release of the 8N but never put anything into production until the NAA Model. Ferguson had been fired by Henry Ford II in 1946 when he took over as CEO upon his grandfather's death and his first order of business was to dissolve the 'handshake agreement'. FORD engineers designed the 8N without Ferguson and much, if not all, was kept from him including developing POSITION CONTROL and a better hydraulic system. Ferguson had been bitter about the Ford arrangement as early as 1942 and was secretly seeking a producer for his own tractor. He used FORD 9N Blueprints, with all the Ford logos blotted out but all the manufacturers he approached knew darn well it was the 9N. A few Ford engineers and CEO Kyes were alerted and Ford kept Ferguson in the dark after that. When Ferguson came out with his TE20 and TO-20 models, almost all part numbers were identical to the Ford numbers except the '9N' prefix was deleted. When the Ford-Ferguson team began designing the 9N in November, 1938, Harry wanted an OHV engine, 4-speed transmission, and flip up hood. Ford engineers overruled his request and had to redesign everything about the new 9N including the 3-pt hydraulic system. Ferguson got his wish with his TE and TO tractors with the OHV, not introduced on any Ford model until September, 1952, with the NAA Model, and a 4-speed trans, introduced on the 8N Model. By the time Ferguson won his lawsuit against Ford, the "Ferguson 3-Pt. Draft Design was obsolete and the courts allotted Harry about 1/10th of his original suit price. Contrary to popular myth, Ferguson was not an engineer nor the designer of the 3-PT Draft Control System though he had all the patents in his name. All the credit for the draft control system goes to the Ferguson team of engineers -Willie Sands, Archie Greer, and John Chambers.

    Tim Daley(MI)

    Bruce(OR)    Posted 06-16-2020 at 21:45:47 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: unknown gear cluster in very front of center section
  • That would be a Howard. If the gears are not chewed up, you might have something. If the gears areunched, then you Know why the handle is gone.

    JMOR    Posted 06-16-2020 at 17:04:05 [URL] [DELETE]        [Reply] [No Email]  
  • Re: unknown gear cluster in very front of center section
  • Sounds like Howard transmission to me.

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