Dan-
I don’t think this is you unless you moved to Texas. I was scrolling thru ebay this morning and spotted this item; interesting to say the least. It is one of your front mount timing jigs, listed at $42. Description says it is part number 9N12000, which is the actual real part number for the early 9N distributor so that is a lie and it is a FORD product.
Now I’m not sure if this is legal or not but I think because it is out in the public domain there is nothing you can do. About a year ago I spotted on ebay JMOR’s WIRING PICTOGRAMS in an auction AD. It hadn’t had any takers then and I never checked back to see if anyone bought one. I passed it on to Jesse then. I thought I bookmarked it but could not find it on my ‘WATCHING’ list. Also, about ten years ago I saw and AD on ebay for a DEARBORN manual that was pilfered from here and my collection. How did I know? I have the original and it has some penciled in writing marks on it and was clearly the same manual. This manual I posted in the NTC MANUALS FORUM so it should still be there. I contacted the seller and said he stole the manual from the NTC, and I was the original owner so was pursuing legal action against him. He ended the auction early and I never saw it again though I wasn’t planning on contacting a lawyer anyway. I just thought I’d share and make others aware there are unscrupulous people out there in it for a quick buck. The sad part is some poor soul is not aware of TOH or the NTC and will buy it off ebay for more than what Dan charges. Caveat Emptor.

FORD N TRACTOR FRONT MOUNT DISTRIBUTOR TIMING JIG:

Current ebay ad:
…ebay.com/itm/155647812491

Tim Daley (MI)

• TIMING JIG on ebay

This guy has already sold 18 of them and it looks like he manufactured 25. Here is his description of the item and he references Dan:

Shaft Locking and Alignment tool for timing either FORD or aftermarket FRONT mount 9N & 8N tractor distributors

Not sure what the improvement is but he is charging double what I get.

Maybe he would like to buy up my current stock - I probably have 50 or so....

Dan

Dan:

You say you have some of these jigs?
I'd like to buy one if it's not too high.

LeRoy

Ed-
Yeah, "20 sold", but says over 1400 other items sold. Click on "Seller's Other Items" and this is the only item that comes up for him. I never put much into those statements, heck it's the Internet so anything is possible. I'm sure those can be and are faked by sellers. I opened an alleged POS FEEDBACK reply by a random guy on his site and looked at his (alleged buyer of a jig) 6 months of feedback replies and no reply from this jig seller. Always skeptical.

I'm expecting someone like Red Rock Mfg. to start repopping them. Maybe when Dan retires?

Tim Daley (MI)

<< over 1400 other items sold. >>

LOL.....you say that like it's a bad thing. He sounds like a pretty successful eBay seller to me.

Yep. Free enterprise. It's not a licensed by FORD/AUTHOIRIZED item so whatever goes goes. I'm just putting this out there for an FYI. Dan wasn't the first one to invent a timing jig either, btw. Our late friend and fellow admin Farmer Dan Howe made one similar to Dans' and was going make more to sell. Dan/TOH improved Howe's design using better parts and so Howe didn't pursue his any further. It's like the ZANE THANG. Position Control addition for 9N & 2N's, now repopped by Red Rock.

Tim

Actually I took it on in cooperation with Dan Howe. The new design was a simplification of one John Smith had made for his personal use.

TOH

Its amazing the things you value and the things you don't.

Apparently by your measure it takes no business acumen to be successful ebay seller. I left ebay sbout 15 years ago not because I was unsuccessful but because the fees were onerous and were forcing me to raise prices to levels I thought were unfair to the customers who I viewed as friends not piggy banks to be plundered.

What do you think would happento mogbill's sales if I put up a Buy It Now ad for jigs (50 available) at $20 delivered? His sales would tank and I would probably get some orders. His investment in the jigs would be ruined and I would be king of the hill once again. That' successful business man Ed Gooding would do in a heartbeat because that's exactly how Ed Gooding thinks. But I won't because mogbill is not hurting me in the slightest and I bear him no ill will. Maybe mogbil needs a hundred bucks or so profit to keep him and his family financially afloat. I do not so as far as I am concerned that money is his to enjoy.

That's a philosophy that absolutely eats at your core and makes you seethe when you see it in someone else,. You have put that anger on public display in this thread. It has also led you to turn this website into a cess pool of hate and driven all of the regular traffic you used to enjoy away.

This thread has remained at the top of the list because NOBODY COMES HERE ANYMORE and that's all thanks to you. You, Ed Gooding, have personally ruined this site while YT prospers.

YT prospers because they allow an open exchange of information and opinion and do not allow, encourage, or promulgate hate. The do that without wielding the delete thread button that you employ here to make sure your agenda is not challenged by anything so radical as polite and reasoned exchange of opinion.

I suspect this thread will not survive much longer after I post this so have already saved a dump. for posterity. Delete away.

Sincerely yours,

TOH

Touché Dan. I don't think you are in any danger of losing business. Like I said, I highly doubt if he has actually sold 20 as he says. I couldn't find any data to back up his claim so its all BS. whatever...

Tim Daley (MI)

<< What do you think would happento mogbill's sales if I put up a Buy It Now ad for jigs (50 available) at $20 delivered? >>

Because you really don't have 50 made and ready to go. If you do, walk your talk self-sustaining hobby boy.

<< that's exactly how Ed Gooding thinks. >>

You have no clue how I think, well other than I obviously don't think much of you.

<< NOBODY COMES HERE ANYMORE >>

Again, another assumption from someone who has no clue. You are not privy to the analytics behind this site, or have any idea of how my lurkers come here. Perhaps they lurk because they don't want a snarky, whiny response from a phony who likes to present himself as the smartest man in the room.

<< YT prospers because they allow an open exchange of information and opinion and do not allow, encourage, or promulgate hate. The do that without wielding the delete thread button that you employ here to make sure your agenda is not challenged by anything so radical as polite and reasoned exchange of opinion. >>

That's an absolute crock. Kim Pratt has heavily wielded the delete function and banned some of the folks who founded this site because she didn't like their posts. She nuked every one of Don Barkley's posts because she felt he was competition to her parts selling business. And, if you think YT is so much better, why not keep your pretentious butt over there instead of coming here. Polite and reasoned? Read some of Dell's and Hobo Rosser's past posts when they did not like a question or comment. Keep showing your ignorance, Danny boy.

I'm not going to delete crap. I like people seeing how whiny and full of crap you are.

Careful Ed - signs of a boil over showing. YT hit a little too close to home? I also know all about that feud and your problems with that management. You are much saver here where you set the terms.

I also know exactly how you think about a lot of things and that's why I hold a very low opinion of you as a human being. But unlike you I manage to avoid making an issue of it here and elsewhere and try to simply be civil.

You are right about one thing though - I don't have 50 ready to ship - I over estimated and only have 37 in the drawer - see picture taken minutes ago. I am not going to list them on ebay and ruin that guys auction. Instead I will offer then to you in private sale for the discounted price of $700 delivered to your door via USPS Priority Mail. They will ship three days after your check clears my bank. Then you as a successful business man can deal with ebay and the fortune to be made there.

Furthermore, if you want to place an order for an additional 100 @ $15 each I will see how fast my laser contractor can turn them around. Lead time is usually 3-4 days to cut after I email; him the order plus a day or two for UPS to get them to me. The same delivery terms apply.

Money talks Ed - BS walks. Pick a number from 1 to 137 and write a check. I think you have my address....

TOH

No boil-over here, Danny boy. I'm having fun with you. You are projecting, as usual. You are just not smart enough to be much of a challenge.

Ummmmmm....I bought one of your timing jigs when you first announced them. I also bought one of your sleeve removal/installation tool kits.....you remember, the one with the major design flaw that ate roll pins by the handful just to remove four sleeves? You know, the flaw that you never informed me about, even though other purchasers had notified you of the issue? You know, the item that, once I returned it, you sat on for EIGHT months before you sent me v2.0? That is not what I call fair and ethical treatment of your customers but is an accurate reflection of your lack of integrity as a businessman..........errr....self-sustaining hobby boy.

So now we move to a different gripe. I remember our initial business dealings perfectly,

You personally picked the original set of tools up in the parking lot outside NIST - my place of employment. At the time I had the impression you did not trust me and wanted to lay hands on the goods before paying. No skin off my nose and I took no offense, The tools were in a "finely crafted wooden storage box" which you opened, inspected the tools, found them very much to your liking, expressed your happiness, and left with them.

At a later date I discovered a problem with the jackscrew and fixed it. I did not notify any customer of the problem so you got me there.

Now I am a little fuzzy.

At some later date you returned something to me for replacement. I am guessing just the jackscrew because you apparently liked the tools but had discovered the one and only problem with them. I am also guessing the return was at my expense since that has always been my policy. If I sat on the replacement part for 8 months you got me again but you did ultimately get your replacement.

You were ultimately made whole, have a functional set of my first generation sleeve tools, and presumably they work fine. Still you are unhappy about your transaction.

So I will make you another offer. Ship the tools back to me at my expense, The only requirement is the be in the original box and undamaged condition, with the exception of normal wear and tear. I will refund your original purchase price in full. You will have had the use of the tools for over a decade at absolutely no cost to you.

If that is agreeable to you box them up and I will send you a prepaid UPS return shipping label along with your refund and I will arrange for pickup at your residence or place of business if you still have one. I have absolute trust you will return the tools after you get my payment.

If that's not agreeable to you I can only conclude you got a really good deal on the tools at that early adopter price, they continue to provide good service to you, and you don't want to part with them. You simply want to continue to lob personal insults because you don't like my way of thinking. That is truly sad and I mean it wholeheartedly.

TOH

<< I remember our initial business dealings perfectly, >>

Yeah? No you don't. I knew that, if I fed you enough rope, you would eventually hang yourself. You not only put the noose around your own neck, you slipped off the stool because of the b.s. you loaded on top of it. Arrogance is always the downfall of clowns like you.

<< You personally picked the original set of tools up in the parking lot outside NIST - my place of employment. At the time I had the impression you did not trust me and wanted to lay hands on the goods before paying. No skin off my nose and I took no offense, The tools were in a "finely crafted wooden storage box" which you opened, inspected the tools, found them very much to your liking, expressed your happiness, and left with them. >>

You are completely and totally full of it. I am so glad that we are having this "discussion" to show folks here what a phony you are. I have NEVER met you nor even know what you look like. You mailed the tools to me. I have NEVER been to the NIST and have no clue where the building is. You have just slipped on your own b.s., Danny boy.

<< You were ultimately made whole, have a functional set of my first generation sleeve tools >>

I'm calling b.s. on that, too. I shipped v.1 back to you on my dime and then had to nag you eight months later to get the promised replacement second generation of the tool kit. Again, not an ethical way to treat a customer. You never apologized - you are too narcissistic to ever admit fault. Your excuse was that you "were too busy"......I guess selling those 500 timing jigs...

<< Still you are unhappy about your transaction. >>

Wrong again. I am unhappy because of the unethical way you treated me. You cannot even spell "customer service."

<< Ship the tools back to me at my expense >>

Not necessary. On February 6, I sold the sleeve tools and the timing jig to a long-time member here. He is one of the lurkers here that you were not aware of.

Oh, this is getting more fun with every lame response from you. LMAO!!!

I guess I had you confused with someone else who drove up from that area. Hardly a hanging offense.

TOH

My laser sub contractor has quite a few of my drawings on file and ready to go should I want to place an order. All he needs from me is the drawing number and units desired to quote me - usually in a matter of hours. I then remit electronic payment to him and he schedules the job. In a rush I can drive the hour each way to his shop and pick up my parts when they come off the table. Not cost effective in general.

Your friend,

TOH

Dan retired 14 years ago - the machine shop is a self funding hobby. I sent this aspiring entrepeneur a message telling him I had no objection to him selling copies of the jig but I did object to his use of my name without even asking. He apolgized and said he would remove it so we are fine.

TOH

Given that you have no patent on this jig, what objection could you reasonably have, other than to whine about it?

I see you are still being a jerk Ed

And I see that you are still engaging in childish insults instead of running your "self sustaining hobby." Man, you transformed a "business model" into a "self-sustaining hobby" in record time, Danny-boy.

You say you have 50 but your website implies that a prospective customer may have to wait rather than order one right there.

"Due to illness the machine shop is operating on a reduced schedule.
Please contact us for information on product availability and lead times"

>> Maybe he would like to buy up my current stock - <<

Maybe you should ask him directly. I don't know if he visits here.

The jigs are one of the things that are still in stock. All you have to do is inquire like the website says. Thats actually always been my policy.

As for my current inventory I was being sarcastic - I have no interest in selling it.

Dan

So, a prospective customer has to jump through some hoops to even see if you have one in stock, while the eBay guy has them available immediately. He is selling them like hotcakes at double your price while you are sitting on 50. Perhaps you should make your website a little more customer-friendly.

Do you have any idea what my situation is right now? I am sitting here waiting on some poor soul to die and donate his/her lungs so I can keep on breathing.

My cell phone could ring at any moment day or night and I will have 3 hours to get the hospital.

If/when that call comes I wont be getting back home anytime soon and if/when I do I wont be filling orders for timing jigs or any thing else anytime soon.

I talk to total strangers multiple times a day almost every day and they dont seem to think there is anything customer unfriendly about my "business model". In fact just the opposute. They seem quite pleasant and happy to talk, share ideas, and solicit advice. I am not making money but I am making friends and helping people.

Dan

If, by your own admission, you are "...not making money..." then you do not have a business model - certainly not a successful one. You may have a social club or a mechanism to get your ego stroked, but as a "business", it is a failure.

The eBay guy who you made the sarcastic comments about is clearly a real-deal entrepreneur. He saw a need, filled it, and offered his products in a customer-friendly way where they can get online, quickly buy it with no hassle and be using it on their tractor 2-3 days later. Even at twice your price, he's selling them like crazy. In fact, he sold another just over the duration of this thread.

In a successful "business model", sales revenue talks, weak competitor b.s. walks, Dan.

Thats more like it - under 5 minutes. Maybe you need an assistant. LMAO

You know, given that your time on this planet may be limited, perhaps you should spend it unloading that inventory of 50 timing jigs instead of wasting it with childish, personal insults. Just a suggestion from a successful businessman, Danny-boy.

Not too worried about my lack of business success Ed. I still managed to pay my bills, feed, house, and clothe my family, send two kids to college, and secure my wife's future after I am gone. Assuming she does not blow it on a young gigolo the kids will enjoy a nice inheritence when she departs the world.

Meanwhile my jigs are still available for anyone with a Hamilton and the time to send me an email. Get them while they are hot - the future is uncertain. Of course I am an optimist so if these sell out and I survive the gutting I will order another 100 and lose some more money. Over 500 sold so far and counting. Maybe the eBay guy will have more success than me.

Happy Tractoring

Dan